What's the probability of a water leak causing subfloor damage?
The Situation: I had a washing machine hose rupture and spill approx 20 gal fresh water across the floor of my loft within a multi-unit building. Water leaked into the garage below, prompting HOA concerns. A remediation crew was called in and has been running dehydrators, though high moisture readings remain in some spots.
There is no visible damage. No warping or cracking of the floor.
The Problem: Determining if the floor needs to be torn up to further remove moisture. Determining if significant damage/mold exists in moist areas of the subfloor.
The Questions:
- Is it possible through professional experience / data to determine if tearing up the floor is necessary?
- Does a low-volume, short-term, fresh water spill present a high enough likelihood of mold/damage to warrant intrusive repair?
- Are there monitoring steps that can be taken to test for mold before tearing up the floor?
I'm getting professional-grade, CYA vagueness on this subject. I'm hoping to find solid, experience-backed advice that says "There is an X% chance of Y happening in this situation."
Any help is beyond appreciated....thank you...
Commentaires (13)
User
il y a 5 ansDernière modification :il y a 5 ansWhat is the flooring material? What is the subfloor material? How long was the water down before being removed or finding that exit point?
Sammy
il y a 5 ansDernière modification :il y a 5 ansIf the floor is tile, where are they getting these moisture readings from? Is the garage ceiling concrete or drywall? Do you have pictures of said-disaster? Pictures always seem to aid in diagnosis (for me, anyway). Post some?
Ryan Kelly
Auteur d'origineil y a 5 ansThe floor in my unit is tile. They test it using a moisture meter. They are also doing mitigation work from underneath in the garage. There is no visible damage so pictures are moot. What exists in the subfloor is unknown until the floor is torn up, which I'm hoping to avoid. The hypothetical is...if elevated moisture exists, is it a high or low likelihood that it a greater problem will arise? IE, do I really need to tear my floor up, or might it be okay on its own.
User
il y a 5 ansWhat is the garage ceiling material? How much water migrated into the garage in relation to how much stayed in the loft?
Short term water is not a problem as long as the entire area dries completely. Mold/mildew spores are everywhere. Moisture(long standing) is the trigger for growth. The probability of moisture being trapped in the sub floor is high, since the water obviously permeated past it into the garage.
Tearing out the floor/subfloor is expensive. I can pretty much guarantee having to do so AND remediate mold will be a LOT more expensive.
Barn door/horse time. Preventive maintenance means changing cheap washer hoses at least every two years or buying braided hoses.
PROHankins & Associates, Inc. - Kitchens and Baths
il y a 5 ansI would think it's an insurance claim in which case they'd likely not be keen on having the potential of mold now or later. Could there still be moisture below the tile? Yes. Everywhere? Don't know. Not knowing all the parameters, I'd personally take the path of being more aggressive with remediation.
Jenn TheCaLLisComingFromInsideTheHouse
il y a 5 ansThey had to remove the tile under the vinyl under the plank in my basement (if I had known the floor guys were installing the plank on top of a vinyl tile which was on top of tile I would have had them stop and remove the two layers that were there before they put the plank in!), the lower 24" of drywall, all the doors in the basement, the 3rd bathroom vanity, and the carpet in the family room area and 3rd bedroom/office/craft space when there was a pipe blockage - one small pair of child sized socks somehow managed to get flushed down the toilet in the kids' bathroom - that ended up sending water from elsewhere in the house (master bath/toilet/sink and kitchen sink water) up through the laundry standpipe in the laundry room which backs up to one of the walls down in our furnace room in such a quantity that the floor drain out of the house to the main sewer line couldn't handle it all and it wasn't 'clean' or 'gray' water. When the water heater suddenly turned into a geyser-like fountain we were able to shut it off pretty quickly and it was clean water so after mopping and wet-vacuuming plus a few days with dehumidifiers along with those giant noisy fans saved us the pain of having the newly installed drywall redone! The basement water damage we were able to file a homeowners claim on, one thing people should note is that they have the duty to mitigate the damages as soon as they notice a problem - if that means calling the remediation company first and THEN your insurer, that's how you need to do it. If you call about possibly making a claim, even if you don't end up doing so, it goes on your file because the insurer will be looking for ways to minimize how much they have to pay out on future claims. If you ask about water damage claims, but ultimately don't go forward on that claim, but down the road you have water damage from a different issue that might be difficult to get your insurer to pay out on too - they look for reasons to deny claims, they make much of their money paying out out less than they take in with premiums and deductibles. Mold is a non-covered issue (usually) if it's due to lack of maintenance or failure to address the issue at the time and where it started. They don't cover sewer main backups that originate outside of your home and the loss must be sudden and unexpected.
How do I know all this? Well...The basement. :P I've probably driven the poor workers a bit mad with all the moisture readings I've asked them to take just to be sure (I know it's dry but the irrational part of me wants to be totally certainly 100% truly sure of it!) Now we're just waiting on the flooring to come in and once that's installed the whole project will be finished. At least we don't have problems with the windows down there (yet!) and they're above grade. There's good drainage away from the house outside, all we need to do is avoid further socks being flushed down the toilet! We're still not quite certain how that happened but at this point it's sort of moot and the damage done.
ci_lantro
il y a 5 ansDernière modification :il y a 5 ansAlready asked but not answered. What is the garage ceiling? Drywall, concrete????
What is the subfloor? Concrete, plywood???
If the garage ceiling is drywall, it needs to be pulled down. Wet insulation. Also will allow the floor above to dry faster. With the garage below (leaky air space) and possibly/ probably high humidity, dehumidifying is an uphill battle. (Unless you live in the desert Southwest.)
Besides getting upgraded washing machine hoses, make it a practice to shut off the water to the washer at the valves when you finish doing laundry. Upgrade the valves to quarter turn ball valves if the valves are those cheap stem washer type.SJ McCarthy
il y a 5 ansIn my neck of the woods we can 'guess' the subfloor material by finding out how many STORIES the condo building has. If it is 4 stories (or less) I'm going to guess you have a wood-frame condo. The underground garage normally has steel or concrete posts holding it up and those are attached to steel girders. The rest would probably be wood frame (with some concrete topping for good noise reduction - if the builder wasn't Cheapo McCheap).
If your condo building is more than 5 stories then everything is most likely concrete. Age of the building MIGHT change these parameters...but usually that is a special situation in a special city like San Fran or NYC.
Quick question: How many stories is your building?
Ryan Kelly
Auteur d'origineil y a 5 ans>>Quick question: How many stories is your building?
Not sure how to asses that, as it's a converted warehouse with a garage level and three stories of lofts, but each loft is a 20ft split-story in itself. It does appear that the subfloor is concrete on plywood as suggested, and moisture readings show the wood is dry, with the assumption being moisture is trapped between the concrete and the floor tiles.
User
il y a 5 ansDernière modification :il y a 5 ansLots of condos have gypcrete, not concrete. That gets saturated, the tiles are gonna pop up.
You have to have someone on site that has a clue as to the construction of the building. Isn’t there a super or handyman? Go find them. ASAP. Because if it’s plywood and drywall that got soaked, you need way more than dehumidifiers.
SJ McCarthy
il y a 5 ansSophie's on it. The "concrete topping" is often "light weight concrete" which is a lovely euphemism for "gypcrete". And gypcrete is a PAIN IN THE @SS to deal with!
Even if the floor tiles have to come up, the GYPCRETE is going to be your biggest headache.
Good luck.
Michael
il y a 5 ansHow long were the dehydrators running?
We had a similar incident earlier this year when I didn't tighten the (upstairs) washing machine's bottom filter tight enough. I started a load and went downstairs. Minutes later, water was dripping down from the kitchen ceiling which is right under the laundry room. The remediation company set up dehydrators in the laundry room along with drilling holes in the kitchen ceiling and running dehydrators there attached to sheets of plastic to contain the airflow to the holes in the ceiling - this was to dry the the subfloor and the floor above from both the top and bottom. It took almost 2 weeks, but was perfectly dry when they were done.
Perhaps in your case, they need to run the dehydrators longer, and from the garage as well.
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Ryan KellyAuteur d'origine